No Basis


It happens all the time. I tell someone that I don’t think there is enough evidence to prove the existence of God, and they claim that I have no basis for morality, love, purpose or hope. Pick any positive emotive emphases and it is taken away from you by a Christian because they can’t understand how you can have it without having God as the backdrop for it to exist.

Take love for example. I have been told that if there was no God, I wouldn’t be able to love, but because I do love, there is a God. Now forgive me if I am wrong here but that really does feel like circular reasoning to me. I mean sure, we can both agree that I love my children. But what I am trying to say is that I don’t agree that there is a God who is the basis for that love.

Rather than work backwards by invoking the existence of a deity who is the fabric upon which my love for my children is woven.

But that’s the issue with believers. You are constantly told that your God, who is different from a whole host of other professed versions of God, by the way, is the source of everything we see, think, breath and live. But that doesn’t mean He actually is. We know that we have standards of morality that have shifted over the millennia, we know that we have a love for those we live with, more often than not. We know that we can create and embellish purpose into our own lives and we also know that we can foresee hope, even if ultimately these positive emotive emphases don’t have any lasting value. They hold value right now, and they make a difference in how and why we lived yesterday, live today and will live tomorrow.

I can hear the old religious Sam in the back of my head now, claiming that just because I don’t believe in God doesn’t mean He isn’t real and doesn’t orchestrate all of our lives. But I don’t think the old religious Sam has any evidence that isn’t personal preference or inference that would hold water on this point.

If you could prove in a deity, who created and sustains everything, then you would have won the Nobel Peace Prize and be on the front cover of every news website in the world. You would also be saying the same God who provides the basis for morality, love, purpose and hope is also the same God, who is right now allowing a male predator somewhere within the world to kidnap, rape and then kill a little girl. It happens every couple of hours within the world we live in, but we don’t like to pay it attention to it, because it is a heinous crime and the culprit deserves to be behind bars for the rest of their days.

I look at my children and I am aware that the same fate could, in fact, be in store for them. It fucking terrifies me. I don’t have any control over their fates, other than to be a sensible and diligent parent and protect them with my very life. But you can’t say to me that there is an all-knowing, all-powerful, all-loving God who is orchestrating this existence to give us the simple chance to possibly know him. How often do we get varying accounts of what a knowing God is anyway within the world? Surely the truth would be clearer to understand.

You see, I would rather nothing had ever existed, no pain, no sorrow, no frightened child who is right now aware that they are going to die at the hands of someone who views them as a commodity to be used and then thrown away.

I know this is the world that we live with. It’s fucking dark and it scares the shit out of me each and every day. But I am willing to say that these things happen, as much as I don’t want them to. That I will fight to make them stop, that we can make things better if we work together and stop waiting for a divine being to wade into the world that you claim they created and take responsibility for the evil they facilitate each and every day.

I don’t think there is enough evidence to show a supernatural explanation to the world I witness around me, but that doesn’t mean that I am right, it simply shows that I am yet to be convinced. I believe that morality, love, purpose, hope and grace arise naturally, that they take their position within the world as they do precisely because the world has evolved as it has.

You might want to evoke God as the reason for these things and you might want to use the things you see around you as proof that He exists. But I want you to stop for a moment. Pretend there is no God watching over you right now. Yep – I am sure it’s a scary thought if you are being intellectually honest with the activity. What if this state is actually the correct one that we really live within? What if God is nothing but an idea that humans invent to grant hope and the actual place we find ourselves in isn’t the one where God is a reality?

Could you still have morality, love, purpose, grace, reason, hope and worth without a God? Sure, none of it will last forever, but even if it didn’t, I am not sure anyone could live like that was the case anyway.

_End of Blog Blurb_

Thanks for taking the time to read my blog. It has taken me a few years to get to a place where I am able to share my loss of faith and to start writing about the journey that I am still on for you all. I hope you find it useful.

Podcast: If you like what you read then you could always check out the podcast ‘When Belief Dies’, it is available on all major podcasting platforms or you can listen via YouTube. Dave and I upload and publish via Anchor FM each Wednesday at 7 am.

Grammar, spelling, capitalisation and punctuation: I am massively dyslexic. It has taken me years to get to the level I am currently at with writing and I have done this mainly through reading. I want to be better and ask you, reader, to please forgive any errors in my writing. I hope you notice improvement upon improvement over the coming years.

Time Frame: This blog is roughly twelve months behind where I currently am at in my journey out of religion. It’s important to remember that when reading and commenting.

If you want to connect with me, then you can get in touch via any of the social media links that can be found at the top of the page. If you want to get every post straight to your inbox then you can do that by either following directly via WordPress or with your email address, whichever you prefer – the links are to the right.

I’ll see you back here at the same time next week 🙂


When Belief Dies #78 – 'A Scholar in the Wilderness' with Dale C. Allison When Belief Dies

This week Sam and Daniel are joined by Professor Dale C. Allison Jr. The video version of this conversation can be found here on our YouTube channel 12 hours after the audio version goes live. We take a look at Professor Allison's beliefs and work, as well as what he thinks it is possible to know about this world and the claims the Bible makes. This is a really refreshing conversation and sees Dale C. Allison balance faith, searching and knowledge in a really impressive way. Dale C. Allison's Bio: Dale C. Allison is an American New Testament scholar, historian of Early Christianity, and Christian theologian who for years served as Errett M. Grable Professor of New Testament Exegesis and Early Christianity at Pittsburgh Theological Seminary. He is currently the Richard J. Dearborn Professor of New Testament Studies at  Princeton Theological Seminary. You can find/follow Dale C. Allison Jr here:   Princeton Theological Seminary Resources mentioned in this episode:   The Historical Christ and the Theological Jesus Night Comes: Death, Imagination, and the Last Things The Resurrection of Jesus: Apologetics, Polemics, History We hope you enjoy our show. When Belief Dies aims to honestly reflect on faith, religion and life. Your support via Patreon enables us to cover the costs of running this show and look to the future to make things even better as we build upon what we already have in the works. Please take a look and consider giving. Alternatively, you can support the show with a one-off gift via PayPal or Bitcoin. Use the following link to navigate to the website, to find us on social media and anywhere else we might be present online. #Podcast #Deconstruction #God #Agnostic #Christian #Atheism  #Apologetics #Audio #Question #Exvangelical #Deconversion #SecularGrace  #Exchristian
  1. When Belief Dies #78 – 'A Scholar in the Wilderness' with Dale C. Allison
  2. When Belief Dies #77 – 'Carts, Horses & Certainty' with Roger Bretherton
  3. The Ehrman Episodes #1 – 'Christ & Christmas' with Bart D. Ehrman
  4. When Belief Dies #76 – 'Purpose & Pokémon' with Daniel Kelly
  5. When Belief Dies #75 – 'Handbooks, Atheism and Honesty' with Dr Joshua Bowen

4 Comments. Leave new

  • Great blog and pod cast . I’m on the same journey as you guys, left the church just over a year ago after many years.Have had many emotions, what I cannot get through to Christian friends is that I didn’t have a choice in the matter. Also I’m now starting to see their love and friendship is somewhat conditional which really hurts after so many years, I’m annoyed with myself when I look at all the Christian books I have and think of all the time spent reading and studying. When a real good Christian friend knew I was reading Richard Dawkins he said how can you read fiction from such a nasty character, I said have you ever read a Richard Dawkins book. His reply was no I don’t need to as I know all about him. I thought just try one book and you may see god is the nasty unpleasant guy.
    I listen to your pod cast and I listen to the atheist experience—-I so wish we had that here.
    I do miss church community, and if I saw on bit of evidence of god I would be back—or would I. Because I’m not to keen on god burning many people I love in hell because they used there common sense and still couldn’t find any evidence of god.
    Also these days I notice many Christian apologetics keep doing the rounds because they have yet another book coming out, William Lang Craig, John Lennox etc . All having a say about Covid19 and god’s presence and protection from their houses . No laying of hands on now in icu wards.
    John Lennox I used to hang on to every word he said, now I revisit his Christian debates on u tube and cannot understand how I fell for the argument. Indeed the truth does set one free.
    Keep up the good work with the pod casts

    • whenbeliefdies
      October 24, 2020 4:30 pm

      Thank you for this Colin! Appreicate you reading and enaging with what we are putting out there.

      I still really like John Lennox. I recently sent him an email asking if he would come onto the podcast, I doubt he will say yes, but it can’t hurt to ask.

      I can ask him why he beleives if he does, should be a good convo if it ever takes place 🙂

  • … and they claim that I have no basis for morality …

    These days, when I hear that argument, I point to Donald Trump. He is the most immoral US president ever, yet he was elected mainly because of votes of Christians. By voting for Trump, they have completely debunked their own claims about morality.


Leave a Reply

Tags: , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,

You May Also Like

Book Review: Outgrowing Religion
Anyone can know


Must Read

%d bloggers like this: